Interesting recent report on why the flu can affect some people worse than others and the work going on behind the scenes to find a cure.
I would like to point out that many of us had jabs for smallpox, polio & other illnesses, when we were children. I am sure that very few of us were likely to come into contact with the diseases, but a few did and suffered the horrendous consequences.
The whole point of vaccinations is to stop the disease becoming an epidemic & ending the lives of many & the flu vaccine is given for the same reason!
I have my flu jab every year, even though I believe my chances of getting it are unlikely. Why do I have it then?
I have it because I don’t want to take the risk of catching it, but also because I don’t want to pass it on to people I spend time with either!
Everybody is entitled to make their own decision on whether they have the flu jab, or not, but I don’t want to be responsible for infecting others if I did get flu.
I don’t know anybody that has died from flu, but I have heard of many who have died from Pneumonia, an infection that many catch when they are weak & in hospital with breathing difficulties.
There is normally a 5-10% chance of death in these circumstances, as the lung sacs fill with mucus…and not having a flu jab may be the reason you are in these circumstances.
Pneumonia is often the cause of death, in many patients, because it is caught by people who are already suffering from other illness.
It takes a few days for you to realize you have the flu, and you could pass it on before you know you have it… so I don’t want to risk the lives of others in my family ( and that includes children) just because a company on the internet say I don’t need my flu jab. When the flu jabs were started, I had them & will continue to do so for the rest of my life , as I have never suffered anything more that a slightly sore arm for a couple of days.
You cannot get flu from having the jab, but you may get a cold virus, as that is likely to be around when the flu jabs are given… but you are not likely to die from having a cold, are you?
There is no evidence whatsoever that the flu vaccine could or will stop or prevent any epidemic of Flu. None at all. This is empty rhetoric. In fact I am 100% sure that if there were an epidemic we would discover extremely quickly how utterly useless the flu vaccine has been and is as millions of vaccinated people would get the Flu.
Your reasoning is badly flawed but you are free to do as you wish of course but others should know why that reasoning is flawed.
When your body becomes exposed to Flu virus you will contaminate other people just as you would if you didn’t have the vaccine. In fact a study has shown that vaccinated people spread Flu to others 6 TIMES MORE than unvaccinated people. So the TRUTH is that those people having the flu shots are the ones putting everybody else at risk. Quite possibly killing others along the way.
Either way, being vaccinated DOES NOT stop you passing Flu virus onto other people. Do the research and you will find this out for yourself.
As stated above, you SHOULD NOT have the flu shot then as by doing so you ARE infecting others up to 6 times more than if you didn’t have the vaccine.
This is annecdotal. People suffer badly from Pneumonia because their immune systems can not cope with the sheer volumes of virus invading the body. That happens because they have weak immune systems (either through bad lifestyle or other illness). Having the Flu shot stresses the immune system as it has to expend valuable resources fighting off what it thinks is a Flu virus and it does so at that critical time in the year when colds, ILI’s and Flu are circulating. Not a good thing to do imho.
Pneumonia is NOT flu it’s entirely different. Weak and vulnerable people can get Pneumonia simply by following bogus advice to take paracetamols and Neurofens to bring down a fever/temperature during a cold or ILI. Doing so completely obstructs the body’s natural defenses as the fever is purposely there to stop the virus replicating. Bring that fever down and the virus replicates with gay abandon and overruns the body in no time. For older people this can kill them simple as.
Correct and this is the same whether you have the vaccine or not.
You ARE risking the lives of those people because when you get the Flu you will spread it up to 6 times more than if you didn’t have the vaccine.
This is only true for adults who get inactivated virus shots. Children on the other hand get LIVE virus and so very much ARE BEING GIVEN THE FLU. Those children will then infect everyone else around them for a period of 1 to 2 weeks.
Regardless, the problem remains also for adults. The inactivated virus flu shot still causes your body to react as it it were fighting Flu and thus it stresses your immune system and uses up valuable resources. This happens at the same time that colds, ILIs and Flu viruses are circulating (the “Flu Season”) and so leaves older adults vulnerable for a period of time. If they catch a cold, ILI or FLu in that time then they are not likely to fare well. If instead they had not had their Flu shot and simply taken time and responsibility to boost their immune system through eating good foods and staying healthy then they would have vastly improved their chances.
This post epitomises the extent of misconceptions about both Flu and the Flu vaccines imho. Vaccines don’t stop you getting the Flu. They help the body deal with it if/when you do get the Flu, however, peer reviewed studies and research have shown that the extent of how much they help is extremely tiny as to be next to useless. They help about 1 in 100 people.
The very best way to prevent suffering from Flu is to keep your body and immune system in good condition.
Vaccinated children should, imho be completely isolated and quaranteed for a perion of at least 1 week. This should be taken extremely seriously because there’s no doubt in my mind that children are spreading Flu from vaccines and that in turn is killing older people.
Imagine if they were being given live EBOLA virus and released into the population!
There would be an outcry. Yet when it’s Flu we seem to just let it pass ! Go figure !
I don’t know why I bother posting on Flu jab threads because i know you will try to dispute what I say.
I am not going to argue with you because you just want to continue your battle with Pharmaceutical companies who make money on medicines.
I will make 2 points though…
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Of course pneumonia kills people because their immune system isn’t working well, that was my point! Flu & other illnesses makes people very ill, so when their immune system is overtaxed, an easily acquired infection like pneumonia will be what kills them. That isn’t my thoughts it is facts that come from the many doctors who see it happen & a consultant who helped a friend on mine survive pneumonia on 3 occasions. Not because my friends didn’t have a healthy lifestyle, but because he had a tracheotomy which exposed his chest, more readily, to pneumonia. The answer was to move to a drier climate like Australia…and he did!
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Many of the members on here take medication, and without those medications, which are researched & manufactured by Pharmaceutical companies, some may have become very ill or even died without them. There would be no medicines if Pharma didn’t research and manufacture them! I certainly wouldn’t be alive today if it wasn’t for the work the pharmaceutical companies do. Don’t knock them because one day it may be you that needs their help! :shock:
I think we are all sick of hearing flu jab arguments, so I am going to ignore them in future. The members on here are intelligent enough do their own research & make the right decisions for themselves! If they think they are not, they would be better served speaking to somebody with the right qualifications, that they can share their health problems with!
BTW, I have a full understanding of how vaccines work and have never suggested that they stop you catching the virus.
They stimulate your immune system to create many anti-toxins which fight the infection & some will remain in your body ready to fight any further cases.
And your credentials for giving such advice are???
Oh yes. NADA. Zip! Zilch. Zero!
Why not let others google for their own advice instead of playing make believe Dr. Realist.
I mean… get real. 
Well said, Bratti.
I think the majority of us are sick to death of the endless posts about the same subject.
No doubt shortly, in the Autumn, it will start all over again, same as it does every single year - it’s been done to death!
Same subject.
Same arguments.
Same person.
We at least used to get a break in the summer months, but this year it has gone on the entire summer, too.
How many times do I have to say, for Christ’s sake stop trying to interfere with other people’s health choices!
Their choice is their own private affair for reasons only they know.
This obsessional behaviour needs to end.
This is hugely childish.
It is not MY credentials in question here. I am merely highlighting the facts presented by medical research and studies. You are in error to attempt to cite me as their author.
The links to the studies are all given in other Flu threads
If you want to argue that the Cochrane Institute is without qualification then go ahead. You will make yourself look a complete tool though. They employ 1000s of very highly qualified medical staff and they set the global standards for how medical testing is done. Cochrane is the medical benchmark of independent testing which highlights the bias in other less independent testing.
But this is pointless as if you can’t decipher a message from the messenger nor understand who the message is from then this is all beyond you.
I only dispute when things are incorrect, factually incorrect.
No argument from me there. Illnesses of any kind stress the immune system, sap resources and leave you vulnerable until your body can recuperate and resupply itself with those lost resources. But none of this has any bearing on the flu vaccine. Except that, as I stated, having the flu shot does exactly that, it stresses your immune system, saps valuable resources and leaves you vulnerable for a period. I wonder how many elderly people get their flu shots, stress their immune system in so doing and then subsequently pick up a virus going round and suffer very badly from it? And in how many of those cases is it Pneumonia that they get and die from it?
And again this is generic and not pertaining to the flu vaccine. It’s silly to equate the flu vaccine with every other form of medical treatment or drug.
Patently untrue sadly. I mean you yourself in your post stated that you have the Flu vaccine so you don’t spread Flu to your family or kids. If you HAD done your research you’d know that having the flu shot means you will spread Flu around 6 times more than those who don’t have the slu shot.
That’s what these threads are about. Presenting the facts so people can make more informed decisions.
It’s odd that so many people get uppity about it all. Facts are good, research is good. Good for you, me, everyone. We need more facts because the medical industry and NHS are NOT giving the facts to us and are simply using conditioning and fear tactics to pressure us into making bad decisions for our health.
You can say as many times as you like but it washes off me like water on a duck’s back. We are debating the flu vaccine. Simple as. Nobody is interfering with other people’s health choices. Information is being brought to the table for people to consider, good facts, independent research, government ONS statistics, relevant studies and so on. It helps us make more infomed decisions about our health.
You hate this topic, you hate the debate yet you rant in each and every Flu thread. Go figure !
Either way, please stop trying to suppress information and knowledge through such insults and abuse.
If you don’t like the facts being presented, don’t read/follow the thread.
I am NOT trying to ‘supress information’ as you so ridiculously state. I am merely asking you to put a flamin’ sock in it!
And DO NOT try to tell me what I can or cannot read or comment on either.
I will do what I want - like it or lump it.
nobody can question credentials that do not exist!
Oh the irony !
YOU can not tell me what to post. Get used to it and stop making a scene of yourself.
For all those who think differently than Realist about the flu jab, I would suggest that you totally ignore his posts on that topic, because the Cochrane Org are not posting their blogs for the good of our health, so they must be making money out of it!
Realist has no qualifications in this field, so only knows what they print in their website. If I could be bothered, I would find another authority that have completely different ideas to Cochrane, but I have established by my own research that the flu jab is my best option & I assume everyone else will do the same! I feel it is best for the forum to stop this constant arguing about it because the same things are posted every year… and it is getting boring.:roll:
If any of you are worried about it, try asking somebody who knows what they are talking about, rather than what you, or anyone else finds on the internet!
All vaccinations do is stimulate your immune system to produce anti-toxins, so they are ready and waiting for the virus to arrive. In many cases it won’t arrive… but I believe it is better to be safe than sorry!
Bye bye to future flu threads!
Moving on . . . .
Evidence here that Flu vaccine effectiveness is reduced for those who routinely get vaccinated. It’s from 2015 but still relevant.
[size=4]Repeated flu shots may blunt effectiveness[/size]
“Universal influenza immunization programs, available in virtually every province and territory, may need to be reconsidered in light of emerging evidence that repeated flu shots may blunt the vaccine’s effectiveness in subsequent seasons.”
“The BC network’s estimates of this year’s flu vaccine efficacy, published in Eurosurveillance, were −8% overall and 2% in young adults against medically attended, laboratory-confirmed influenza A (H3N2) infection — which Skowronski said she interprets as a null effect. This also represents the lowest measured protection against a seasonal virus in the program’s 10-year history, she added.”
“It recently became known that this year’s H3N2 virus was not a match for the H3N2 component of this year’s trivalent vaccine, but the authors of this new study also saw variability in vaccine effectiveness that was related to prior vaccination history”
" Universal influenza immunization programs, available in virtually every province and territory, may need to be reconsidered in light of emerging evidence that repeated flu shots may blunt the vaccine’s effectiveness in subsequent seasons.
That phenomenon was seen in the Jan. 29, 2015 interim estimates of the effectiveness of the 2014/15 vaccine against influenza A (H3N2) from Canada’s Sentinel Physician Surveillance Network, headed by Dr. Danuta Skowronski of the British Columbia Centre for Disease Control."
Interesting stuff !
And it’s excessively arrogant and irresponsible to suggest these senior members need YOUR bias input. They can do their OWN research which I suggest everyone do if they are unsure.
I’m NOT in error as I’m not citing you nor do I care to debate or argue about this topic with you.
Don’t think for a moment that I actually care what you think of me because I don’t and you can twist this around into any shape you like. The end result is that you are dishing out medical advice with NO QUALIFICATIONS!
If you are taking this info off the internet ( which we already knew) then why not just add the links instead of pretending to be superior to the rest of us. It’s so predictable and so unwanted but you don’t seem to care.
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