Yes @summer , Boris is everything that I feared he would be, the man is a complete personal shambles which would always end up being reflected in his leadership performance. OK, so he got Brexit done in a fashion, but that really was the end of his usefulness and I completely agree it is beyond time for him to go.
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I have voted Conservative ever since I was old enough to vote and we have a very good Conservative MP here. However, I am absolutely dismayed by the shambolic way that the party is being led at the moment. I am in a quandary now because I can’t support the Tories at the moment but there is no other party who will get my vote - on the other hand I can’t not-vote either! Hopefully things will become clearer by the next election.
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Interesting. Seems like there’s a bit of a question as to whether Boris will be like the Captain of the Titanic and go down with his ship, or like the Captain of the Costa Concordia??
Trouble is that despite debacle after debacle, still the main opposition party looks like a ramshackle bunch of headless desperados.
Which leaves BJ in the position that his govt might still have time to recover and so he can leave with his head held, if not high, then not entirely in shame.
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I think Cameron turned out like that because of what Blair got away with . Prior to those two I believe (rightly or wrongly ) prime ministers had the country’s interest’s, now its what I (PM) can get out of it, maybe its always been like it but now its so open. So no I’m not embedded.
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That’s my stance on the man, he’s a one trick pony, Brexit,end of.
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Trouble is Dex there doesn’t seem to credible opposition these days, the Tories back in 2010 couldn’t command a majority with out climbing into bed with the Libs, since then Labour have stalled, it shouldn’t be hard with Boris in charge but Starmer isn’t up to it,
The press play easy too, the recent press conference announcing plan b, they had him on the ropes but backed off , maybe it wasn’t the right platform but the opportunity was lost imo.
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I have heard and read that comment so many times. Of course you are absolutely correct that Labour would be dangerous if they ever got into government and the Liberals are the same - ‘Labour Light’.
But it’s as if nobody else has ever heard of Reform UK, or that they think they are so small and new that they are not worth voting for.
Perhaps they’re right, but in my opinion they are the only political party who could replace the Conservatives and have similar views to what the Conservatives used to have in the pre-May days.
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I have certainly heard of them JBR but I would have to be convinced that they could form a viable government before I gave them my vote because voting for them could let in the Labour party by the back door.
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Yes, I take your point. In that respect, there are only two parties: Conservative and Labour, so it looks like the Conservatives will remain in government in 2024. The lesser of the two weevils.
It has often been said that we have a ‘two-party system’ and it looks like we’re stuck with that.
Strangely, 100 years ago that was also the case with the Tories and the Whigs, until Labour came along and formed the government in 1923 or 4, I think.
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I have become a floating voter !
I think the only one l could vote for at present is Lord Frost ?
But he would have to leave the Tories and become an independent or summat ! The Tories are so riddled with
remainders that Frosty would be quickly neutered or ejected by
them if he tried to complete Brexit properly ?
So he needs to start another form of conservatism ! In which
he dumps much of the existing civil service and establishment
structures , maybe joining with reform UK or some other like
minded body !!
He seems to be the only one present that has the interests of
the UK at heart? Every one else seems to think that Brexit has
been" Done" and are now busy with petty squabbles etc ?
Unless something happens to change things l have given up
on UK ever becoming a place with a future again !
Donkeyman! 
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Thinking back, Nigel only came into power (IMO) on the back of the Public feelings about the need to leave the EU.
I’m still not clear why Nigel did not strike a better deal, with Boris, when Boris was getting “back In”.
That must have been a time when Nigel could have stood his ground a bit more.
That leads me to thinking what would happen if, at another election, the same questions get asked.
Maybe, this time, more influence would be with Nigel, if he choses to have another go!
Trouble is, the Party has no seats & is not influencing the public much?
It seems to me that Nigel doesn’t have staying power and that is a reason I would find it difficult to vote for any party with which he was involved.
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I am my own person, no political party can lay claim to my allegiance and my vote is based partly on the worth of the local candidates and partly on party performance/ their manifesto.
At heart I am a liberal although the once honourable Liberal party has disintegrated into a shambles that is not worthy of being considered a serious party.
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@ Tedc, Yeah. you are right Ted, l think Boris had promised
Nigel a good position in the government if he got elected ?
But being Boris, he renaged on the deal and then ostracized
Nigel once he got the landslide victory in the election !
Unfortunately for us Boris also lied when he said he would " Get
Brexit Done" !! What we got, was what Boris considered to be
Brexit ??
Frosty seems able to say no to the EU , but we will see this
week end when the so called French fishing deadline expires??
Donkeyman! 
John Major, Michael Heseltine, Ken Clarke and Chris Patten are all senior Conservative politicians who are demonstrating that their concern for the country outweighs their political allegiances. They have all announced that even Tory supporters should put their trust in one of the other parties. These guys value honesty and integrity - which are commodities that the current administration has no idea about at all.
Boris is a shitty smear on the face of British politics.
Dated: 7th December 2019
The majority voted for Brexit.
These guys may not be the best example of MPs who press for what the Majority want.
In fact, some went well beyond the limit in trying to prevent it!
They’re dead men walking!
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@ Lindyloo, Yes but, are those geezers in your link leavers, or
remainders Lindy ??
It is imperative that any new government should be in favour
of leaving the EU if any vestige of democracy still exists in
the political establishment ??
Donkeyman!
PS. I question the assertion they have any integrity too ??
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I agree. I’d very much like to see the disgruntled Conservative MPs form a group with a common interest of returning the party to its previous form. I’d like to see them allying themselves with Reform UK in the hope that enough people vote for either the break-away Conservatives or even some of the Reform UK candidates who stand.
I realise that Reform UK does not have as much public support as they need, and probably won’t have for a long time (if ever). However, if we have a number of ex-Conservative MPs standing as independents and even a few Reform UK candidates, we could have the beginnings of a new political party which does not suffer from the disastrous Boris and Carrie all-green Conservative party.
I’m not sure what agreements, if any, were made between Boris and Nigel. All I am aware of is that Nigel’s party stood down in order to split the vote and allow Labour in.
Of course the party has no seats. That’s because so many people are afraid to vote for them because they believe that no-one else will! Is that what they call a ‘self-fulfilling prophesy’?
I wasn’t aware of that, but of course it rings completely true as Boris is behaving very much like that right now.