Brexit benefits - where are they?

Controversial: Politics & Govt Brexit
2024

This thread, I understood, is about the (lack of) benefits from Brexit. Not about asylum seekers.
But now that you’ve raised the topic of people travelling through EU countries to get to the UK - perhaps you might consider:

  1. More asylum seekers stop in countries in the EU than there are people who do travel on to the UK. Many more. France receives 2-3 times more.
  2. Many asylum seekers have connections with the UK that give them reason to wish to reach the UK. These connections might be family or friends. The connection might be language. Or it might be bungled UK actions - leaving behind interpreters in Afghanistan, or the botched Cameron intervention in Libya, or they come from a previous UK colony.
    When the repulsive Anderson said “eff off back to France” what he did not note is that most European countries receive more, per head of existing population, than the UK does. He basically was saying that in his view the UK should not take anywhere near the same share of this global problem as other countries. You are saying the same. Nice.
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2033

God, how long will it take to sort this out?

2034

I thought he was saying if the barge / accommodation was not up to their liking there was an alternative. .

2035

Bet none of these folks have ever heard of Hobson!

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2037
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2038

https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.telegraph.co.uk%2Fcolumnists%2F2023%2F08%2F15%2Fchannel-migrant-crisis-liberal-hypocrisy%2F

Liberals are oblivious to their hypocrisy over the Channel migrant crisis

Whenever anyone says migrants should stay in France, British centrists are furious. But logically they should agree

he row over small boats has been raging for a very long time. Yet there’s still one aspect of it that I don’t understand.

Since 2016, British liberals have given the consistent impression that the EU is an earthly paradise: prosperous, stable, forward-looking and inclusive. By contrast, they fume, Brexit Britain is a hateful, backward, crumbling, economically doomed dump.

Their position is clear. Yet, whenever anyone suggests that migrants should stay in France – the largest country in the EU – rather than cross the Channel to Britain, liberals are appalled. They react as if it’s unspeakably cruel and inhumane.

Logically, however, they should take the opposite view. They should think it’s cruel and inhumane to make the migrants stay in nasty old Britain, rather than the heavenly EU. If anything, British metropolitan liberals should be gathering in their tens of thousands to form a human barrier all the way along the Kent coast, in order to prevent migrants from entering – for their own good.

“Turn back immediately!” they should bellow through their loudhailers at every approaching dinghy. “Do not, repeat not, seek sanctuary in Britain! This country is a failing, bigoted, corrupt, austerity-ruined, sewage-sodden, virulently Islamophobic hellhole populated by ghastly Tory-voting gammon who worship statues of slave traders and despise anyone whose skin is any colour but crimson! So for pity’s sake, turn your boats around, and enjoy a glorious new life in elegant, cultured, joyously cosmopolitan France! We’d leap aboard and join you ourselves, if only the stupid Brexiteers hadn’t ended our freedom of movement!”

That at least would be logically consistent. Instead, however, British liberals are still outraged by Lee Anderson’s suggestion that migrants return to France. But why? Don’t they think these poor migrants have already suffered enough, without having to endure the misery of life in Brexit Britain? What makes liberals so eager to inflict this fresh horror upon these desperate, vulnerable people?

It seems dreadfully callous of them. I think it’s time they showed some compassion – by campaigning to shut our borders straight away.

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2039

What a stupid article well worthy of the Torygraph

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2040

It was both stupid and actually quite offensive. It applied that right wing twisted logic “if you criticise the UK then you must hate the UK, if you hate the UK then (insert insulting suggestion here)”. It is not terribly different from calling someone who is moderately wealthy a “champagne socialist”. As if it is not possible to have social awareness & conscience and at the same not be poor.
These are examples of very limited thinking and a sure sign the author knows their own stance is without merit and perhaps even morally corrupt.
PS it has nothing to do with Brexit benefits so this article has no place on this thread. It will have a fine place in the dustbin of course.

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2041
2042

For those wishing to rejoin the EU, which UK trade deal would you like to start with tearing up first in return for the EU FTA we would be paying £12 billion a year for, which we currently get for free ?

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2043

In the letters page of The Telegraph:

https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.telegraph.co.uk%2Fopinion%2F2023%2F08%2F22%2Fletters-callous-criminals-option-skip-sentencing%2F

Benefits of Brexit

SIR – Britain’s manufacturing sector is starting to benefit from Brexit.

This summer, Make UK revealed that manufacturing employment is growing in 75 per cent of English regions and the whole of Wales. Yorkshire and the Humber has seen the biggest jump.

Manufacturing companies are moving more production back to this country, and British customers are now expressing a preference for British-made products.

British exports are growing as well. My company has been exporting for the last 157 years but has never done much in Europe. Post-Brexit, thanks to us onshoring production back into our own factory, we are now selling more than ever to Europe.

By carefully selecting which products to onshore, using the latest techniques and designing for manufacture, we can make products more cheaply in Britain, improve quality, offer more features and radically reduce lead times – all while lowering the carbon footprint of production.

Manufacturers and consumers also need to think about the ethical implications of buying from countries that don’t have the same values and standards as our own.

Contrary to popular belief, this is proving to be a good time to be manufacturing in Britain.

David Millar
Managing Director, Heap & Partners
Birkenhead, Wirral

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2044

Yes, but when they arrive on the beaches raring to go you all complain about them. You can’t have it both ways.

2045

It’s OK to criticise the UK and not hate it, I wouldn’t be surprised if everyone in the country has done this at some point including the dyed in the wool patriots. I also don’t think using a term like “moderately wealthy” is helpful when it’s pretty clear that the champagne socialists are in a wealthy minority. It’s nothing to do with social awareness and conscience either, it’s about the principles of socialism - maximum taxation, spreading wealth and working hard. These people who we call champagne socialists are hypocrites as they don’t apply their principles to themselves, only to others, usually far less wealthy than they are. They should realise like most of the altruistic poor, that you don’t need a socialist government to spread the wealth, you can do it under your own free will.

I snigger at your term “morally corrupt” too. Can you explain what that means please and what you are comparing it to ?

2046

… Continued …

It’s time the socialists admitted why they are really upset about Brexit. It’s not because of trade (wealth), zero tarrif trade with the EU (reduced taxation) or cheap foreign labour (reducing “hard work” for the wealthy), all the things that go against the principles of socialism.

The reason the socialists are upset by Brexit is because by leaving the EU, the UK rejected also socialism itself, as it is this that the EU has been built on since the 1950s. Founded by communists like Alterio Spinelli (who has an EU Parliament building named after him as a tribute) with an agenda to drive Europe into a supranational United States of Europe, run by unelected bureaucrats with no opposition. Its colonialism without war. Already each EU country no longer referred to as such, instead being called a “member state”, all singing a national anthem they don’t own.

The biggest Brexit benefit the UK has is that is it is no longer part of the EU Project. It was doomed to failure at the start (it failed several times to become the European Union with many countries including France rejecting it until it was forced through under the Lisbon Treaty, and even then some countries (Ireland etc) were forced to vote again). Now with the abolishment of national vetoes, unveiling the hidden truth about its undemocratic intent to the people, with the Eurozone in a death spiral, recession hitting the German powerhouse, the end is in plain sight.

We should never rejoin the failed EU project for it would be economic, democratic and financial suicide.

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2047

The Australian/New Zealand one, please and the CPTTP, for starters

2048

Why would you want to tear up these trade deals in favour of only having tarrif free and quota free trade with the EU ? We have been trading less and less with the EU for the past decade or so, by rejecting these other trade deals it would mean imports being more expensive.

2049

It gets right in my bits when Brexiteers refer to the Brexit decision as the decision of the U.K.
Brexiteers spouting their xenophobic drivel do not speak for the whole of the U.K.

It was a very close vote, nearly half of the voters wanted to stay in and got dragged out and our futures diminished by a small majority

“The U.K.’ didn’t vote to leave the EU, “The U.K.” didn’t “reject socialism” ( and I doubt if rejecting socialism was a reason many Brexiters voted out either)

Just because you right-wingers don’t like left-wingers it doesn’t mean that everyone who voted Remain was a socialist or that it’s a left-wing plot

The are many, many reasons why reasonable people are appalled and disgusted by Brexit and what the Brexiteers have done to our country and our children’s future and I can assure you seeing it as a defeat of socialism isn’t one of them

But being repulsed by the rise of the Rabid Right, anti woke, GBNews watching brigade definitely is

The only way to restore our future prospects, hope and integrity as a country is to rejoin, if the other members are generous enough to forgive our treachery and have us back

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2050

Its clear you’ve bought into the nonsensical thinking that is hating people who have wealth but recognise that wealth distribution through progressive taxation is a necessity and that good social care for all is another necessity. Here is why this thinking in nonsense:
If you support progressive taxation then you support across everyone in the country. Not a single centre / left of centre supporter expects a get out for themselves - so they do apply their principles to themselves. And you do need to do this via state taxation rather than individual giving - giving won’t even begin to cover the costs and so many people will not give up money unless obliged to do so.
The reason the term champagne socialist is loved by the right wing thinkers is because they hate the notion that someone who has wealth actually recognises the social injustice of everyone keeping as much wealth as they can and paying as little tax as possible. They hate this because such a person, the so called champagne socialist, is highlighting that it is possible, even correct, to consider the selfish retention of all one’s money as wrong. Having a conscience about everyone in the country is right. In short, it frames those wealthy who cling to every penny and fight against every tax rise as plain selfish and bad for society. So the right wing thinker needed a term that seemed insulting (actually its a compliment) and sounded like this decent person was being two-faced. But only the right wing thinker would consider it two faced to have champagne in the fridge and still not vote right wing.
It is clear you do not understand this and have latched onto the term as an insult. Enjoy your wealth and keep it to yourself seeing as you despise champagne socialists. And call yourself the opposite - perhaps a ‘bitter tory’.

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2051

You believe that governments are better at spending your money than individuals themselves ?

Choose which country you think best represents your views.

2052

It was nothing like you say, Maree.

Look at how constituencies voted outside London - the result is overwhelming, even in Labour heartlands such as Hartlepool, Blyth etc.

The EU is based on socialism, the whole point of it is supernationalism. When voters were given the opportunity in a referendum to leave or remain, over 1 million of the voters voted to leave.

Your points about the “rabid right” and GBNews watching brigade are not very helpful - I’m not sure what you mean, although referring to phrases such as “xenophobic drivel” would imply you haven’t thought your answer out very well.

Rejoining the EU would be a complete disaster, for a start we would be liable for part of the €Trillions of Covid relief fund (around £190 Billion) and in the middle of our cost of living crisis (resulting from lockdown policies and the war in Ukraine) I don’t think that would be supported by the tax payer.

The EU never worked for the UK - we got nothing out of the single market anyway Maree.

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