It’s perhaps too easy, which is why I can’t take to it.
Not just in the UK it seems. Yet it would depend on what generations understand by politeness. What can be observed over here is that an increasing number of, mostly younger, people want to do away with social distance (not distancing) and formality as is also expressed by the language used because they don’t feel comfy with it. There’s a trend towards using the less formal “you” too early and, thus, towards trying to impose a certain cultural standard on others, mostly elder people. These people feel confirmed by a number of companies also using the familiar “you” for their target group(s) in customer relations. This trend has to do with demographic changes but also with a decreasing respect, and even contempt for authorities, institutions, services (fire brigade, emergency ambulance, police) if not hate in a number of cases.
As for social etiquette like holding a door open for a woman, many a man are confused, it seems, because an increasing number of women don’t want to be treated in that way any more and say so. Holding a door open for a another man is often considered “uncool” anyway.
The answer to the question “Who actually “decides” what is polite?” is clear: No one because it is gradually negotiated by society.
Dex, what about when younger? You sure there is never a little smirk when you think about an extra special “Blast from the Past”.
Nah! At the other end, nearer HM.
Thanks for your input @Dachs and it’s good to see you here too BTW.
Yes, I had noticed a decline in Germany too last time I went - which was a few years pre-Covid.
But if I might pick up on one example you mention, that of holding doors?
I mention it in the OP too and it is problematic.
Even though I can understand that for example some females feel stereotyped just because it happens to be a male holding a door open for them, why on Earth do they seem to completely disregard the obvious alternative which is a door slammed in their face?
Isn’t that even worse?
Times change, but it strikes me not only as sad to see a decline but also because it’s a decline in what were once seen as traditional British values that we were known for globally, one such being our politeness.
It was certainly a problem when we were visiting family down there just pre-Covid.
My BiL & family are country types, horses/shooting/fishing etc. and even in such circles it’s so bad that they have commented about a few notable examples too.
Which leads me nicely to … that it’s “horses for courses” I suppose.
I find young people - teens/early 20s - are often polite. But, say, 25-55s not so much.
I like travelling by bus around the west end of London. I’m late 60s and quite often give up my seat to someone older, or younger if they look like they need it. I see people half my age not bothering.
I was discussing this with Mrs d00d the other day, and [racism alert] we decided bames are none too courteous.
Re teens: girls are better than boys and individuals are more considerate than those in groups.
Exactly. “Decline” isn’t the correct word. Manners, values etc evolve and change.
Wow there have been some excellent posts on here, makes for great reading thanks.
I have to say that where I live, people are noticeably more patient with and considerate of each other post-covid. I notice too that people are much more eager to strike up conversations with strangers (in a queue, at a counter, with neighbours) in a show of togtherness and community spirit that I haven’t witnessed or felt for a long time.
Perhaps I’m lucky that I live in a town of only 20,000ish residents. There are exceptions of course but that is the general feeling I get, day to day. I include myself in that description too btw.
However what I do witness at school is an increasing number of students lacking respect towards authority and societal values in general. That is a behaviour being acquired mostly at home and is also becoming much more prevalent on social media amongst largely the Millenial Generation.
It’s almost as if that, having been brought up to question things, they now automatically believe the opposite of what they’re being told, even when what they’re being told is true/right/ proven/expert/professional advice or facts.
Apologies if I’ve gone on a bit of a tangent there people!
“Manners Maketh Man”, Dex!
But what about the Ladies?
Only 79p on kindle. I feel a prezzie for the wife coming on.
Oh and on the door holding thing…
I always appreciate it when done to me and thank whoever’s did it, whether they are male or female. I dont think it’s a sexist act, it is a courteous one as it’s better than leaving the door behind you slam in someone’s face.
I always check behind me after walking through a closed door, if there is someone approaching I would hold it open for them. Likewise if I approached a closed door at the same time as someone else, male, female or anything in-between
Plus, of course, it allows one to slam the door in the face of someone you don’t like.
I wonder if the differing reaction is because of the gender of the person doing the door-holding @Rhian; what do you think?
So what is the consensus reached on this forum??
ARE good manners a thing of the past??
My answer would be, NOT QUITE !
Donkeyman!
I think that the consensus so far pretty much seems to be that it’s a fluid concept.
Trouuble is that we’re all susceptable to looking back through tinted glasses at the good old days, forgetting that people our age would have been doing so, back then, too.
There’s a lot to that it’s true, but what about the “holding doors” example which seems plain daft?
I mean: ya really wanna have the door bounce off yer nose, luv?
It’s nuts!
IMHO of course, and things like being barged out of the way aren’t really any better are they?
Am sure we’ve all dutifully queued up for stuff when on holiday abroad and felt the know of outrage when eg our German brethren ignore all of that nonsense and walk to the front with a sense of entitlement. Or when we queue up at a traffic light junction or on a slip road, and someone whistles on by and then pushes in without a please or a thank you.
Doubt than anything’s really changed that much proportionally. But with an increase of population will come an increase in observable incidences.
But we’re not in Germany.
We are a nation known for being polite.