It is a highly progressive idea (so truly hated by the right). Guess which country has actually put it in place? Iran.
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Well you live and learn … Iran introduced a partial Universal Income in 2011 …which amounts to 29% of the median salary.
In the UK, at a figure of 30,000 per annum that would be 10K.
Not a niggardley amount. I was surprised to see how much they invest in 20 to 29 years olds staying on for further education too.
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I think we can all note that Iran is a deeply flawed regime. Of course, worse than that. I would never support a theocracy, let alone a brutal, oppressive one. And yet might they do ok things amongst the horror?
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I could be wrong but if memory serves me right, and it might not … Saddam’s Iraq used to send Iraqi’s to foreign universities if the specialized subject they wanted to study was unavailable at home.
There are many examples you could cite …
Conversely, I always have a bit of trouble adjusting to the idea that the US, presumably the most powerful though not necssarily the wealthiest country in the world, leaves it’s citizens to pay for private healthcare.
I suppose it follows though, getting back a bit more on topic, that China … home to the AI robot explosion , will be the first to find out how it affects society at large, and more specifically the economy.
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Wow, lots to consider.
The US has a fixation on the notion that each person must, completely on their own merit - earn, win, succeed. That concept explains their attitude to health care and welfare. Add on the idea that you keep all what you earn, to spend as you wish, then you get their distain for universal health care. Apply, on top, a hefty layer of zero empathy for the plight of others less fortunate and you get America. It works super well for some.
I’ve been there perhaps 20 times or more. All corners. Zero need or desire to go back, It is a dismal place. Which is a pity as there are quite lovely locations and some quite lovely people.
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Well this is a cheerful topic!
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Well, being caught in the benefit trap must be a bit dire
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I wondered where this thread had gone … it’s resurfaced!
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anyone worked it out yet, let us know so we can prepare for it
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Not sure, social security has only appeared in lyrics once to my knowledge
Social Security took care of this lad
We watch in reverence, as Narcissus is turned to a flower
A flower? 
Should have used the bigger flush button 
They were just talking on the telly about pensions really being a “benefit” and how they won’t be able to sustain the triple lock. I have a feeling I will never get mine as I still have years to wait because the government will need to raid the pot. This is all too depressing to be thinking about.
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You are right that this is truly a worry. Of course there is no “pot” as state pensions are paid out from that years welfare budget. Not like private pensions with a pot of investments (which are reducing rapidly right now thanks to dumb Trump and his big gulf adventure).
My own UK state pension will kick in four years from now. It will be very, very helpful - but it would not be sufficient to live on,
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There’ll always be Social Security. The question is at which level.
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yes that is correct ref paying it out of the pot of government funds received each year from taxation, investments and borrowing. I see this as a pie (chart) and pensions are a slice of pie. So long as there is a pie there is a slice for pensions and if they run out of money for ingredients to run everything they borrow some sugar or flour.
But there is a contract with the population who paid national insurance in good faith and have been conned into thinking that is a pension. So the government have been running a scam all these years if they think they can dip into that part of the Treasury pie that is ring-fenced for pension payments.
So long as we have a good credit rating it works does it not? But the government seem to be expecting the international credit bubble to burst - that whole “great reset” predicted for 2030 appears to be on the cards after all the talk of a conspiracy theory.
Recently I am starting to see how that will actually happen and unfortunately I won’t be of state pension age yet in 2030. I do have a work pension that I can take early but my opinion these days is that if you have money spend it and enjoy yourself while you are young enough before it either disappears in the economic mess we are headed for or is grabbed back by the state. It seems that you only end up being targeted if you have been careful enough to save for the future.
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Governments rely on Actuaries for advice as to how much of the pot to dip into.
Probably.
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Pensions finance is my Bette Noire of accounting studies. It’s right up there with stock control, closely followed by process costing. The words “unwinding the discount” send a shiver down my spine. It’s good that we have people who are paid who actually enjoy this type of tedium and painful number crunching on a macro or micro level.
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I used to love the numbers AnnieS, still do to an extent.
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All true but what there is not, is what you get with a private pension. Those have specific value in total for you - which you can take out as a single lump sum or move to another provider. The state pension is, as you explain, paid out from the slice of the year’s government spending. There is no big lump sum for each of us.
And I’m not sure how the credit rating is relevant. Do you mean that the cost of borrowing will shoot up at some point and that will take a bigger and bigger slice of the overall government spending? And that in turn will reduce the amounts available for all other government spending, including state pensions?
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I meant that if our credit rating goes down the loo the country will find it increasingly difficult to borrow and any credit terms will be really rubbish
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