I haven’t seen any improvements to that since brexit
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There is a lot to unpick here, so sorry for a bit of a long post.
It is going to be true that most people will unable to perceive any up or down from something like Brexit. It is much the same as when the UK signs a new trade deal with any other country - do you ever directly notice a difference? It is only if you look at the national numbers on trade and growth, or if you are directly involved in trade or travel, that you can see a difference. So I would not be surprised if you can’t directly see any change.
That claim requires a bit of explanation and justification. Who? How? And again, why assume being in the EU was not beneficial to all of us? I suspect I could make the same claim the other way round - it was the rich and powerful who wanted the UK out of the EU. Here is my justification - they saw it as way to get the UK to drop lots of employment rules, lots of business regulations and allow them to make more money at the expense of the workers and most likely the tax payer when their schemes created massive economic problems.
The free movement of people was an essential element of the single market. It did not allow people to simply move to another country and claim benefits. There were very strict rules on paying tax before any benefits could be claimed - and each EU country can limit or remove benefits paid to those who end up not in work. Freedom of movement people was primarily freedom of movement of labour (that is, working people).
Each member country was also free to impose limits on the numbers coming to reside - if they wanted to. For example, France, Netherlands and 7 other countries limited the numbers of Romanians allowed to move for the first 7 years of Romania’s joining the EU. If the UK did not place such limits then that was a local UK government decision, not an EU imposed decision.
As for shoplifting - if someone wanted to shop lift in the UK they could simply fly in and shop lift. There was no need to become resident, just do it on holiday. Once resident you are fully signed up to the laws of the country you reside in. Plus, EU countries are able to deport people for serious crimes back tot their country in the EU. If they want to.
If you work and pay taxes, specifically social charges (e.g. national insurance) then you are due the benefit of that. So, yes, if someone from say Poland worked in the UK for 10 years then they are due the 10 year portion of their state pension. Not a full pension. Of course, as they did not pay social charges in Poland for those ten years then their Polish state pension will not be a full pension. Surely that is all fair? It is fully reciprocal. I know British people here in France that have worked here 15 years, after working in the UK for almost 20 years. On reaching retirement age they will get a mix of a percentage of the UK full state pension, and a percentage of the French full state pension. Even if they move back to the UK. After all, they paid into both systems.
If you are familiar with the football or rugby supporter concept of ABE then you will understand when I say that I am ABR.
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I totallyagree with what you say, if someone pays i to the treasury they are entitled to some benefits. If I remember correctly Tony Blair signed an agreement to let Europeans come to our country and that blossomed over the years. I wa t what is fair, our country in my view is weakened for diluting our population with unwanted foreigners. It was ok in a tit for tat way on immigration for many years but in recent years we have been i invaded by mostly young men who sponge off our wekfare system. Perhaps reform will start the fightback but somehow I dont think it will happen.
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Brexit hasn’t stopped a huge increase in people coming to the UK to live. Brexit hasn’t stopped the b oats and it hasn’t stopped the w elfare bill that goes with the b oats. What have all those £millions we were meant to save by leaving been spent on?
seems it might be ok to write boat singular as plural needs approval
I agree but I am fed up with polititians saying we should not have come out of Europe. Europe is a social and economical failure. By all means have defence pacts and trade agreements with Europe but letting them dictate what happens in our country is wrong that is why we have a government. Some european countries have split party goverments that lead to all sorts of problems when it comes passing laws. Do the people who want us to go back into Europe know we would have to give up the Pound in favour of the Euro and our borders would be even more free.
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Those millions are spent on benefits for the illegal immigrants and deals with France that simply the French ignore.
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We don’t have to do any of this and they need us just as much as we need them.
Where is all the money we were meant to have saved gone? Why do we have so many people coming here and being able to stay despite Brexit? Nobody is holding our government to account over any of this.
The appeal for those who took advantage was our very weak benefits system and pathetic application of laws. That was totally our fault. France didn’t have those problems hence people wanted to leave and come here (and still do)
Because it is apparently so easy when I visit the UK next month I might sign on for the dole.
who knows how many billions were wasted on Rwa nda and HS2? There is no accountability to British taxpayers whether we are in the EU or not. The trading relationship with mainland Europe needs to be fixed so that we can regain our strategic position as place multinational businesses want to be based. At the moment Britain seems to be flopping all over the place with no purpose
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Antipodeans would be at the back of the queue for anything Bruce. Although you’d probably get free emergency healthcare and such because we have some reciprocal agreement with Oz.
Sorry but I feel it necessary to correct some things in your post that, to me, reflect a misunderstanding.
By almost every measure the EU has been a success (I’m guessing that when you say Europe you are referring to the EU). The EU is a rich, influential bloc and its single market has been a huge success. Wihat is the basis for you to claim it is a failure?
Please explain what the EU decided for the UK - I am seeking specific examples… And please explain how each year the UK parliament continued to pass laws for the UK - but yet you say that everything is decided by the EU. My own view is the claim “the EU dictates our laws” is a lazy and inaccurate notion. I never hear “the EU dictates German or French laws”.
Do you mean coalition governments? Yes there are a number of them and this is often the outcome of proportional voting. But there is a strong case that such a coalition approach leads to better decision making in governments rather than a majority rule by one party stuck in a single ideology. I give you the privatisation of the UK’s water supply. as an example
A three - way coalition or hung parliament is I believe possible. Do Reform and Labour have any overlapping polices or they’d never agree on anything?
I think you may be proven right. But the more likely coalition would be Conservative - Reform, surely? That would be a little bit funny. Reform with so many defected Tory MPs, creating a government with much more experienced Tory ministers, voted in by people who were fed up with the Tories, and lots of very naive new Reform MPs getting the run around (in the same way the Liberals were shafted back under Cameron’s first government).
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I do Annie, that’s why I’m voting for Reform…It’s all anyone can do…
But who do you think all the incommers will vote for?
Is that why they are allowed to come here?
Both of you are (rightly) unhappy that politicians are rarely held accountable for their wasteful decisions. Money is spent badly and the politicians just shrug. It is not good we all agree.
But.
One of the issues raised was the very costly and wasteful exercise by the previous government to establish Rwanda as a place to send people coming into the UK. And worse than wasteful it was mostly performative by the Tories. Most likely illegal, definitely expensive and soon it became clear it was unworkable.
Guess what Reform plans to do? Exactly the bleedin same. The same dumb, illegal, unworkable concept, maybe a different country, that will cost billions and deliver nothing other than a wave of law suits.
Remind me, which party do you think is going to solve problems? Can you need not see the lack of consistency in your thinking? Rwanda was a debacle so I’m going to vote for more of that please…
Voting reform is not holding the government to account. It’s not a good reason to vote for a party without experience or sensible policies
We don’t have much choice at the moment because all the parties, including the one in power, are full of amateurs nowadays.
if you lose your passport and memory before you get here