AI - Will the machines become so powerful and smart that they can’t be turned off and they outwit man?

[MKJ]

@Realist

And yet your theory prescribes that we engineer fantastically powerful robots and machines and have these same destructive and dangerous people programme them! Pretty sure that strategy led to the atomic bomb, the slaughter of countless people in Hiroshima and the rapid rise for the need of lots of other countries to build up their own nuclear arsenal and sit with their fingers poised over the buttons just in case.

I too gave up on “religion” as such and the “Church” as such finding them now both somewhat perverted and corrupt systems of conditioning resulting in varying forms of violent extremism or the sapping of the human mind of all desire and ability to think freely.

Nevertheless, when earnestly considering who and what I am, I find myself compelled to acknowledge that a part of me at least, does not sit entirely in the physical world. Rationally I concede that this could be a complete delusion on my part or a misinterpretation of signals from my brain. The onus is on me to explore and seek out whether it is true or not.

Mainstream religion and the Church as a whole do not have the answers imo. However, the efforts and works of many philosophers and sages throughout history provide some insights that can help us. Personally I doubt that any man or woman is capable of providing the answers specific to another person. Rather I suspect that every human is unique and individual and has their own path to walk and their own journey to traverse to arrive at the answers that are relevant to them.

Even so, I suspect others CAN help to equip us with the tools and methods by which we might unlock our minds and understand better who and what we are.

If you have a combination safe that is locked and you want to know what is inside it, then I can not help you given that I do not know the secret combination. However, were I a locksmith or safe cracker I could teach you how a safe works and thereby how to perform the tasks that will allow you to open it.

It’s for this reason that my mind is open to the field of Philosophy and esoteric works. There is much to be found in there to help frame ones thoughts and better appraise the world and our experience of it. I will still find my own answers and the journey itself shall doubtless provide one of the most valuable experiences to learn from. Yet had I continued to stumble on through life, yielding to the social programming and conditioning constantly bombarding us, I would never have reached the point where I find myself now. I needed guides and the inputs from works of all kinds to help me set foot on the path that is undoubtedly now before me.

It seems somewhat curious, even illogical, to imagine or expect that humans, who have not yet worked out who and what they are, nor who have tapped and understood the full potential of the brain and mind, could be capable of building a robot that could itself determine those things and become “conscious”. It would be rather like drawing a face on a balloon and hoping that one day it might actually talk to you.

Man can not create a living “end-product” for Nature itself does not do this. For example we can not build or make a courgette. That end-product is formed by a cycle of growth beginning from a seed. Nature acts upon it causing the seed to put down roots and grow into a seedling, then to a young plant, then to a mature plant. It then goes into a phase of flowering in order that it can be pollinated and then the cycle turns to the production of the fruit or vegetable and so on.

Man can imitate Nature, even speed her processes up in some cases but he must always work hand-in-hand with Nature because we are bound by her environment and processes, because we are ourselves, a part of that Nature.

Thus I think that we must as humans, continue through the cycles of growth and evolution before us. Making machines seems unlikely to achieve this for us. The caterpillar would gain little if it were capable of picking up tools and building itself a set of mechanical butterfly wings. The caterpillar must itself enter the cocoon stage and become the real butterfly, thereby ridding itself of the things that previously limited its existence. Similarly Man I suspect, must seek out and enter his own spiritual “cocoon” and be transformed into the next part of existence that Nature has in store for him. I suspect that once this is done, we will have very little need for clunky machines and robots !

Interesting.

Where we differ is I’m more aware of my physical being.

I’ve led an odd life. I suffered a mental breakdown when 17 where only self analyses helped me break free of my condition. I had to alter my mentality to cope with my problems. I effectively became robotic, where most of my feelings were intentionally buried deep. Once I was able to get back into society (5 years later) I went on an intense journey to discover who I was, who we were, why was there religion and so on. I devoured books on philosophy, religion but kept coming back to psychology and eventually such books only. Instead of buggering off and joining some cult (I looked into them and even chatted to various followers) I decided it was more courageous, or suitable, to live within society as it was rather than opt out.

Since the above I have had to cope with acute socio-phobia, hyperactivity, personality disorder and others but cope I have but only because of the support of my parents. To cope with an over active brain I have had to consume considerable quantities of hard liquor at times to calm it down, effectively killing off brain cells.

What am I like now?

Well, I never had a College education and because of my condition (s), when I was younger, it was impossible for me to hold down a job for long. I’ve always been considered an attractive proposition by employers though so moving from job to job has been quite easy for me. This has resulted in me rubbing shoulders with people who I might not have had I received a formal education. Because of this I’ve become far more physical. I’ve also been put on the spot a few times where all brain activity has stopped bar for that very moment - a purely envigorating primitive experience. This has taught me we have far too much brain power and there isn’t much of a need for most of it.

I’m very much a physical being now with a sharp, aggressive intellect. I don’t bog it down with metaphysical theories or take on-board ideas that might cause me to relapse. I can tell when something is not good for me as I get a headache straight away and that is why I can tell some of the content of your replies is bad news and meaningless - something to avoid.

I think you are giving far too much credence to us as a species and evolution such as you envisage is way way in the future; will we get there though? For all intents and purposes we won’t as we are an aggressive species who seem to thrive on conflict.

As for computers and robots, who knows what could be developed in time? Once processors reach the power of a brain (and work in a similar manner) who can tell what it could learn from? What about direct connection to our own brain and thought patterns? The stuff in science fiction novels have a habit of coming true these days.

[May]

At last,a very interesting and non long winded post…thanks MKJ.

[MKJ]

It seems I have finally put this thread to bed .

[Rachel]

Aysa should have the final word … 'tis etiquette innit ?